The Interview: Just Football meets Ossie Ardiles

Upon arriving at White Hart Lane I am ushered through the stadium, out onto the pitch, which is silently being tendered to ahead of Tottenham Hotspur’s upcoming game with Manchester United, and then back towards the home team’s dressing room, where Just Football’s interview with Ossie Ardiles is to take place.

As we walk down one narrow corridor there is a wall of framed photos identifying Spurs legends going back almost a century. Three quarters of the way down, resplendent in Spurs’ white and with the FA Cup sat snugly on top of his head is the man I am about to meet. “Ossie Ardiles – 1978 – 1988″ reads the caption. The diminutive Argentinian is synonymous with Spurs’ history, of that there is no question. As the picture attests, Ardiles is engraved in club folklore. And as we find out midway through an engaging interview, Tottenham is still very close to his heart.

Here, in an engaging interview, Ossie opens up on a variety of subjects including his greatest moments in football, the Falklands War, the demise of Boca Juniors and River Plate, his current favourite Spurs players, Lionel Messi, Maradona, his friends and his philosophies.

JF: Ossie Ardiles it’s a pleasure to meet you. I have some questions in Spanish and some in English if that’s ok.

Ossie Ardiles: No problem.

JF: Let’s start with a few questions regarding England and Argentina. First off: tea or maté?

OA: Maté!

JF: Choripan or fish and chips?

OA: Ooh..choripan!

JF: Parrilla or Sunday roast dinner?

OA: Parrilla.

JF: Gareth Bale or Javier Pastore?

OA: Oooh…good one! Hmmm. This is a very difficult choice. Right now both are the new stars of world football. Both are playing at an extremely high level. But in reality the most important question for both is how far can they go? I hope that is a good enough answer to the question!

JF: Maradona or Lionel Messi?

OA: Again a tough one. Making comparisons between players is always quite difficult. Maradona played in an era of football that was much more difficult for the player. The major difference is that Messi is playing in an extraordinary Barcelona team that is winning everything. This is contrary to Diego who played for Napoli – a team that was quite small and that in reality would have been extremely average without him. He also played in a Serie A that was very, very difficult. It was the era of ‘catenaccio’ and the style of play in Italy at that time was tough, which made it a really testing league to play in. Because of that it’s really very hard to compare the two. Both are total football geniuses.

JF: Messi has now won the FIFA Ballon D’Or two years running. If he continues to perform as he is now do you think history will go on to consider him as one of the best players ever, even better than Maradona or not?

OA: Lionel Messi already is. At the very least he is already at the same level as Maradona, or at the same level as Pele for example. Without a doubt. That is the thing with Messi – he is still so young that he can continue to improve and improve and improve. So you think to yourself “just how much better can this man get?” That is one great advantage in Messi’s favour.

JF: Very interesting. One more then – Bilardismo or Menottismo?

OA: Menottista. 100 per cent.

JF: Ok. So moving on, what would you say was the best moment of your career?

OA: Well it was probably winning the World Cup in 1978, followed very closely to winning the FA Cup here at Tottenham in 1981. To be perfectly honest, I would say from 1977 to 1982/1983 was the best period of my life as a player. Playing was so easy, it was so enjoyable and so on. So that was probably the best time of my life.

JF: What are the philosophies that you learnt as a manager from Cesar Luis Menotti?

OA: Well my background is Argentina and I learnt especially from the philosophies of Menotti. And English philosophies too of course. My principles were always the same to be perfectly honest – I believe 100% in possession football. If you have the ball the opposition cannot hurt you, it’s as simple as that. So that has always been my number one motto. This is why for example when I was playing football, the team I admired the most and the team I least wanted to play against was Brazil, because when they had the ball it was difficult to get the ball from them.

So I have always believed in this kind of principle. Basically when you have the ball you can go to the right, you can play it left to see where the weaknesses of the opposition lie; I’m talking about situations when the other team is very good as well. So to do that you have to have the ball and you have to have possession.

JF: You’ve said before in interviews that you’d like to manage again one day. Do you have any preferences regarding where you’d like to manage, in Spain or England or Argentina for example?

OA: Well at the moment I have three grandchildren here in England so I would prefer to be in England. But I’m open to see what happens. I love to manage to be perfectly honest. Every time I’m in charge of a team I really enjoy it, it’s in my blood. So if a nice opportunity comes from abroad I would think about it. If it was in England it would be even better.

JF: I want to ask you a few questions about football in Argentina. At the moment Boca Juniors and River Plate are not doing very well – do you think there’s any particular reason for that and do you think it’s good for Argentinean football?

OA: Unfortunately in Argentina the championship is divided in two. That means we have two champions every year. That is not something that is proper, I would say. They do it over there because…Argentina is very fanatical about football, but saying that it’s done to keep the interest of people going to the stadium and so on. So it’s a response based on economical reasons. But of course in Argentina like in England, Italy, Germany, Brazil there is only one champion at the end of the year. Because of that I mean the championship is so short – only 5 or 6 months – teams only play each other once in a season. This is why. A lot of small clubs do well for 5 months and suddenly they’re champions. So this is why lately the league in Argentina has not been dominated by any one team.

Of course the biggest teams suffer because of this – especially Boca Juniors and River Plate. Having said that they’re both also experiencing serious problems so there are some other teams right now that have come to the fore – like Estudiantes de la Plata who are champions right now or Velez Sarsfield for example. I think it’s going to carry on this way for a while. Saying that though, Boca Juniors and River Plate now have new managers and I expect Boca Juniors to be serious contenders for the title this coming season.

JF: Being from Cordoba who is your team in Argentina?

OA: My team in Cordoba was Instituto. We won the championship etc etc…but this was far too long ago!

JF: Tottenham are doing really well this season. Just how well do you think they can do?

OA: I think we’re having a great, great season and there is still everything to play for. We are involved in three different competitions – the Premier League, Champions League and FA Cup – so it’s great. We’re having a terrific season but we have to carry on starting with Manchester United on Sunday which I think is a crucial game.

JF: You mentioned earlier you enjoy possession football – which player at Spurs do you most enjoy watching?

OA: There are a lot of players having a great season right now. If we were talking about 6 months ago I’d say maybe our weakness was in midfield. Not now, quite the contrary in fact. Our midfield is probably our strongest area. Gareth Bale is having an absolutely unbelievable season, Van der Vaart has been a great acquisition and the player that is my favourite – Luka Modric – is having a really great season as well. So these are the players that I admire most.

JF: Moving on, we obviously discussed the best moment of your career. What would you say was the worst moment of your career? You’ve often said Las Malvinas (The Falklands War) was a particularly tough time…

OA: The worst moment was the Falklands War, Las Malvinas. It was a war between the country where I was born and the country where you could say I was adopted – England. The two countries were fighting each other and that was the worst moment of my career, yes.

JF: Did you find it difficult being in England and then going back to Argentina as well?

OA: Everything was difficult. Being in Argentina was difficult, being here in England was difficult, being in France was difficult. It was a nightmare time.

JF: Was it something you discussed with your team-mates at all, did you speak about it a lot or did you prefer to keep your feelings to yourself?

OA: No we didn’t really discuss it. There are certain things you don’t really talk about in the dressing room – one is religion for example, another is politics, and of course war is even worse. So we didn’t. But certainly at Tottenham all the players and the whole club really, really supported me.

JF: In hindsight do you think the war affected your own playing career at all?

OA: Oh completely, 100%. I was at the pinnacle of my career, I was playing the best football of my life and suddenly there were serious problems to consider. I started to play extremely badly for quite a long time.

JF: A few years ago I met Mario Kempes, a great friend of yours. Are you still in touch and is he one of the players you most enjoyed playing with in your career?

OA: Yes. Mario is one of those who I played with many times. We played together at Instituto de Cordoba, then for the national team, we became world champions in 1978, we played at the World Cup in 1982 and he’s one of my very best friends in football. He was an absolutely extraordinary player. For me he’s one of the best eleven players I played with in my whole life. And above all that as a friend he’s also an exceptional person.

JF: Ok. We had a question from one of our readers regarding the proposed stadium move away from White Hart Lane to the Olympic stadium in Stratford. Do you think it’s a good idea to move or would you rather stay here?

OA: I’d prefer not to talk about that.

JF: In an interview with FourFourTwo a few years ago you stated that youth development in England is at a poor level, after England failed to qualify for Euro 2008. Do you still think this is the case?

OA: It is the case. One of the problems in England is that, in other countries like France, Italy, Argentina, Brazil and so on there is one entity that dominates football, like the Argentina FA, the Brazilian FA and so on. Here there are two very powerful organisations – one is the Premier League and the other is the FA. And that is part of the problem. The roles of the two are completely different. The Premier League and Premier League teams are only concerned about the Premier League. So the Arsenal guy wants Arsenal to be champions, the same with Tottenham etc etc.

The FA has to look out for the game as a whole. But the interests are completely different. So this is an example of the problem. Even if you are the top man in the FA there’s not so much you can do. That needs to change. There should be one person, one entity, that is in charge of all football in England. If that doesn’t change I think it’s going to be very difficult.

If we talk about what needs to be changed, well one is the development of young players. For example, a very simple question: why does England – as a country where football is so important, that is so fanatical about football – why does England not develop top, top players?

JF: Comparing it to Argentina, in what way are they better at developing young players? What do they do differently?

OA: Argentina developed people like Maradona before, we developed Messi right now…there’s a huge difference. In fact if you talk about Argentina at Under-18 or Under-20 level, if they’re not there winning championships they’re at least always there or thereabouts. Brazil are always there. Not England. So if England is going to win the World Cup not in 2014 but let’s say 2018, they have to be champions at U-18 and U-20 level more or less right now. If that doesn’t happen then the stars of the future are not going to be English.

JF: Very interesting. Looking at world football from a coach’s perspective then who do you think are the stars of the future?

OA: Well the current stars are obvious – Messi is still very young for example, Xavi, Iniesta…

JF: But as an example what about upcoming young players like Erik Lamela in Argentina or any younger players making their name?

OA: How do you know about him? (laughs)

JF: I know a bit…we are students of the game at Just Football! (laughs)

OA: (laughs) Certainly, certainly. He’s a wonderful prospect. But for people here, if we were to individualise players and choose one I would say Javier Pastore is going to be a star of the future.

JF: Pastore. Maybe you say that because he is a former Huracan player? (laughs) (Ardiles coached Huracan in 2007).

OA: Yes, yes I was manager of Huracan when he came to us. He was only sixteen. In fact he was given up by another team because people said “yes, wonderful skill but he will never make it” and so on.

JF: Talleres…

OA: Yes. You know a lot! (laughs) He came from Talleres. I arrived, I saw him and said to myself, ‘Yes definitely. I like him.’ I played him regularly in the reserves – like I said he was very young and made a lot of mistakes – but immediately you could see you were in the presence of somebody different. And it’s wonderful as a manager when you see somebody that is a little bit special. And he certainly was special, and he’s very special right now.

JF: Finally, regarding your World Cup win with Argentina in 1978, do you think that -  because of the problems regarding military rule and the controversies around that – do you think that team is respected enough in Argentina and worldwide?

– Ossie’s phone rings. It’s official – his ringtone is indeed ‘Ossie’s Dream’. Cue laughter. –

JF: Nice ringtone there Ossie.

OA: Thankyou! (he says with a big grin)

JF: So do you think that Argentina ’78 team was given enough acknowledgement and credit?

OA: Definitely. All over the world, yes. Maybe sometimes in Argentina not as much. We have not been treated very well in Argentina, because of political reasons, because the government is quite left-wing right now…and so on. But I don’t particularly like to talk about politics.

JF: So you feel they’re reluctant to acknowledge your World Cup winning team in Argentina?

OA: They should acknowledge it a lot, lot more than they have done to now, yes.

JF: That’s really interesting. Thanks very much Ossie.

OA: Ok thankyou!

– After we finish the interview, Ossie shows me his phone and grins. It was a missed call from Steve Perryman. The man is Spurs through and through. –

Ossie Ardiles returned to White Hart Lane for the launch of the Sportingbet Spurs Zone, a new club website giving fans exclusive access that will place them at the heart of all the action at Spurs. Visit www.spurszone.co.uk for more.

Argentina, Boca Juniors, Interviews, Javier Pastore, Ossie Ardiles, Tottenham Hotspur